Does Eastern medicine (acupuncture and herbs) really work?
In my experience it's very effective. How about your experience? Do you think it might be a placebo effect?
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Mary on -
Acupuncture was the only thing that helped my insomnia, and it practically cured my hayfever. I was pretty skeptical at first, but now I'm a believer.
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Permalink Reply by Greg Anderton on -
Hi Mary,
Great to hear of your health success.
I had a similar experience with it. Acupuncture was the last resort for me and it worked!
Thanks for your reply. Have a bright and happy day.
Mary said:Acupuncture was the only thing that helped my insomnia, and it practically cured my hayfever. I was pretty skeptical at first, but now I'm a believer.
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Permalink Reply by Will Hunziker on -
I'd say the fact that they've gone and made some of the best herbs illegal without a prescription, and turned many others into what we now call vitamins and pharmaceuticals means that at least those work, otherwise; any biologist, such as myself, can give a you a lecture about how sticking things in your body causes immune responses, and about how the healthiest responses in your body are natural immune responses, and that those responses are optimally stimulated by small agitations such as, say, a sterilized needle:) For herbs, the popular business model is to say you can't prove herbs work, until you (a well funded corporation) proves one does... then you modify it so that you can get a patent, and sell that as a drug or vitamin, since it is now proven. Typically, this business model has been highly effective because science takes precedence over historical culture. If the past is a predictor of the future, many of the herbs that are recommended for you today will be prescribed as supplements in the future.
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Permalink Reply by Greg Anderton on
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Hi Will,
That is quite an interesting piece. Yes, Viagra did is very similar to the botanical molecule found in Horny Goat Weed and Yohimbe. Can't patent a plant though...
Thanks,
Greg
Will Hunziker said:I'd say the fact that they've gone and made some of the best herbs illegal without a prescription, and turned many others into what we now call vitamins and pharmaceuticals means that at least those work, otherwise; any biologist, such as myself, can give a you a lecture about how sticking things in your body causes immune responses, and about how the healthiest responses in your body are natural immune responses, and that those responses are optimally stimulated by small agitations such as, say, a sterilized needle:) For herbs, the popular business model is to say you can't prove herbs work, until you (a well funded corporation) proves one does... then you modify it so that you can get a patent, and sell that as a drug or vitamin, since it is now proven. Typically, this business model has been highly effective because science takes precedence over historical culture. If the past is a predictor of the future, many of the herbs that are recommended for you today will be prescribed as supplements in the future.
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Permalink Reply by Maya S on -
I started receiving acupuncture after I realized how weak my immune system was. I was getting sick an average of once a month. Once I started acupuncture, I literally went about a year before I got another cold. I continued to go to my acupuncturist for about two years. Even though I don't go anymore, I can sometimes feel a cold coming on but my body is much stronger and fights it off. (It also helped my sleeping and allergies.) I am a true believer!
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Permalink Reply by Will Hunziker on
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It's actually quit easy to patent a plant, all you need to do it alter it in some way... specialized breeding, recombinant genetics, or simply developing a novel process by which to extract or manufacture the active ingredient works:) You can also modify the end product/processing procedure with any number of organic, biochemical reactions once your first patent starts to run out for extended coverage:)
the hard part is getting your non-natural product through the FDA:)
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Permalink Reply by Greg Anderton on
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I stand corrected. : )
Will Hunziker said:It's actually quit easy to patent a plant, all you need to do it alter it in some way... specialized breeding, recombinant genetics, or simply developing a novel process by which to extract or manufacture the active ingredient works:) You can also modify the end product/processing procedure with any number of organic, biochemical reactions once your first patent starts to run out for extended coverage:)
the hard part is getting your non-natural product through the FDA:)
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Permalink Reply by Greg Anderton on
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That's great Maya! There are many benefits to recieving acupuncture including immunity and vitality. Thanks for your comment.
Have a nice now : )
Maya S said:I started receiving acupuncture after I realized how weak my immune system was. I was getting sick an average of once a month. Once I started acupuncture, I literally went about a year before I got another cold. I continued to go to my acupuncturist for about two years. Even though I don't go anymore, I can sometimes feel a cold coming on but my body is much stronger and fights it off. (It also helped my sleeping and allergies.) I am a true believer!
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Permalink Reply by Brian on -
I'm interested in learning more about acupuncture and its application in treating cancer, chemo and diabetes. I've got a lot going on but I'm reasonably healthy generally speaking.
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Permalink Reply by Greg Anderton on
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Hi Mike,
Thanks for expressing your interest in Eastern medicine. Generally speaking, Eastern medicine (acupuncture and herbal medicine) is a gentle and powerful modality that treats almost any condition. Because it supports the body's ability to take care of itself by promoting the natural function the organs and systems, it is very effective.
Depending on the individual, diabetes (type 2) can be controlled and even resolved through Eastern medicine. Concerning cancer, I find that Eastern medicine is a wonderful adjuct therepy to Western treatment. Many studies have shown that acupuncture and herbs greatly reduce the side effects of chemo therapy and other treatments. I favor an integrative approach to the Big C using the best of both East and West for the highest good of the patient.
Please let me know if I can provide more information for you.
Take Good Care,
Greg
Brian said:I'm interested in learning more about acupuncture and its application in treating cancer, chemo and diabetes. I've got a lot going on but I'm reasonably healthy generally speaking.
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Permalink Reply by Greg Anderton on
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Hi Will,
Your entry was very informative. However I was concerned with you opening statement.
"Generally speaking diabetes and cancer are not diseases acupuncture or herbs are going to cure."
Where is this coming from? Do you have any data to support your opinion?
Thanks,
Greg
Will Hunziker said:Hi Brian,
Generally speaking diabetes and cancer are not diseases acupuncture or herbs are going to cure. Cancer being a collection of genetic mutations causing unregulated growth, and diabetes being either 1) and immune response that kills your beta insulin producing cells in the pancreas or 2) and inability to properly respond to and produce enough insulin. In either case an immune response (acupuncture) is generally not going to help you unless it is with opportunistic ailments accompanying your primary problems.
Something like cancer should be dealt with by doctors, the direct side effects of taxol or something are not going to be helped by herbs or acupuncture significantly:( However, it could help other associated side effects.
Looking into the enzymatic pathways yourself and finding the herbs and acupuncture treatments that might help would in all likelihood... help, but I would not rely on traditional knowledge for how to treat cancer or diabetes. Historically, people would always just die of these diseases, so really, there is no foundation of experience developed over the ages for how to treat things like this. To have a reliable reason to take herbs for cancer or diabetes you would need a strong foundation of western medicine (enzyme product pathways in particular) to supplement your eastern medicinal knowledge; if you can combine the two. You may not always be able to because of a lack of knowing exactly how many eastern herbs work... not that that would be a good reason if your ailment was, for example arthritis... where we know it helps by experience.
For Diabetes; first regulate your blood sugar and exercise to stimulate the enzymes Phosphoinositide 3 kinases and Akt which regulate the insulin uptake receptors. Data on antioxidants generally hasn't been gained from people with diabetes (those who have the highest levels of reactive oxidative species) so it's a little inconclusive but much of the data shows that your enzymatic pathways nullify most of the benefits you gets from antioxidant like vitamin e at supplement levels (your body already has amazing antioxidant systems that work much better than antioxidants, and you would need to take much much much more than the daily recommended amounts to have significant effects), otherwise alpha linoic acid has shown some positive results for diabetics in one of the rare good trials.
For enzymatic treatment there has been some promise in epalrestat to divert hypoglycemic conditions from causing a buildup of sorbitol and downstream products in the polyol pathway (AGES, etc) in cells that cannot regulate their sugar intake, epilthelial, etc... reducing osmotic and oxidative stress... a study of 5,278 Japanese showed a 75% improvement ratio in objective symptoms and a 36% ratio of improvement in nerve function. If you have type 1 diabetes they should be coming out with C-peptide to add back into your regular insulin, which should help regulate you blood sugar levels.
Otherwise acupuncture and herbs will probably help. That's all I got:)
Will
Brian said:I'm interested in learning more about acupuncture and its application in treating cancer, chemo and diabetes. I've got a lot going on but I'm reasonably healthy generally speaking.
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Permalink Reply by Will Hunziker on
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Hi Brian,
Generally speaking diabetes is not a disease acupuncture or herbs is going to cure being either 1) an immune response that kills your beta insulin producing cells in the pancreas or 2) and inability to properly respond to and produce enough insulin. In either case an immune response (acupuncture) is generally not going to help you unless it is with opportunistic ailments accompanying your primary problems. I.e. short term gains from NO O2- vasodilation effects etc... (any acupuncturists can feel free to fill this out a little:) which is good in its own right... however, the cause of the problem is still hard at work.
Otherwise, for Diabetes; first regulate your blood sugar and exercise to stimulate the enzymes Phosphoinositide 3 kinases and Akt which regulate the insulin uptake receptors. Data on antioxidants generally hasn't been gained from people with diabetes (those who have the highest levels of reactive oxidative species) so it's a little inconclusive but much of the data shows that your enzymatic pathways nullify most of the benefits you gets from antioxidant like vitamin e at supplement levels (your body already has amazing antioxidant systems that work much better than antioxidants, and you would need to take much much much more than the daily recommended amounts to have significant effects), otherwise alpha linoic acid has shown some positive results for diabetics in one of the rare good trials.
For enzymatic treatment there has been some promise in epalrestat to divert hypoglycemic conditions from causing a buildup of sorbitol and downstream products in the polyol pathway (AGES, etc) in cells that cannot regulate their sugar intake, epilthelial, etc... reducing osmotic and oxidative stress... a study of 5,278 Japanese showed a 75% improvement ratio in objective symptoms and a 36% ratio of improvement in nerve function. If you have type 1 diabetes they should be coming out with C-peptide to add back into your regular insulin, which should help regulate you blood sugar levels.
Something like cancer, which is a collection of genetic mutations causing unregulated cell growth should be dealt with by doctors, it is not going to be cured reliably by an immune response stimulated by herbs and acupuncture, typically, you need serious, possibly lethal drugs; although you do occasionally hear stories about it working by itself... the body can be amazing. Acupuncture and herbs should more properly be used in conjunction with chemo. In that case, stimulation of the immune system will help it kill the unwanted cancer cells through apoptosis, and speed recovery from symptoms of your primary care. I suppose acupuncture could be more easily adapted to stimulate a response in the necessary regions to spur a healthy immune response.
As far as herbs, typically herbal uses are based on traditional knowledge and cancer or diabetes are traditionally lethal, so really, there is not a good foundation of experience developed over the ages for how to treat things like this. To have a reliable reason to take herbs for cancer or diabetes I would want a strong foundation of western medicine (enzyme product pathways in particular) to supplement my eastern medicinal knowledge; if you can combine the two (an MD and holistic doctor...??? maybe in Boulder:); you may not always be able to because of a lack of knowing exactly how many eastern herbs work... not that that would be a good reason not to take herbs if your ailment was something where we know the herb helps from cultural experience. Otherwise, some basic immune herbs would probably help in a general way.
Anyway, that's all I got:)
Hope that fixes my response for Greg:)
Will
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